Creating Go-Giver Influence

With Bob Burg, a much sought-after speaker at sales and leadership conferences and a co-author of the international bestseller, The Go-Giver. He shows that all companies operating “The Go-Giver Way” not only give great value to their customers, but also are significantly more functional and profitable.

Join us for this conversation to hear more of Bob’s takeaways on why you need not be an entrepreneur to be entrepreneurial, his five laws that will bring you success, and why being a “Go-Giver” coincides with human nature.

Biggest takeaways (or quotes) you don’t want to miss:

  • “Sales is about serving your customers, it’s about bringing value to the marketplace. But in order to do that, you had to be that person who could do that.”
  • “System is a process of predictability achieving the goal based on a logical and specific set of how-to principles.”
  • “Go giver doesn’t mean perfect. It simply means shifting your focus from getting to giving. And by giving, we simply mean constantly and consistently providing immense value to others.”

It’s how much we willingly suspend our self interest, and just focus on bringing immense value to others. There’s nothing so sacrificial about it because the degree you do that is the degree that you develop the know, like, and trust relationship, which drives the business.

Bob Burg

Check out these highlights:

  • 8:40 When you’re selling, you are giving them time, attention, counsel, education, empathy, and most of all, immense value.
  • 12:40 The main essence of the salesperson or an entrepreneur who can both quickly and sustainably create trust and relationships is that they are givers. They are always looking to provide value to others.
  • 17:34 Being a go giver should never be misconstrued as being congruent with being a doormat, a martyr, or self sacrificial in any way.
  • 23:43 The five laws are the law of value, law of compensation, law of influence, law of authenticity, and law of receptivity.

How to get in touch with Bob:

Learn more about Bob, by visiting his website here: or you may visit any of his following social media platforms:


Imperfect Show Notes

We are happy to offer these imperfect show notes to make this podcast more accessible to those who are hearing impaired or those who prefer reading over listening. While we would love to offer more polished show notes, we are currently offering an automated transcription (which likely includes errors, but hopefully will still deliver great value), below.

GGGB Intro  00:00

Coming up today on Guts, Grit & Great Business™… 

Bob Burg  00:04

Giving and receiving are not opposite concepts. Despite the horrible messages of lack and anti-prosperity we get from the world around us. It’s just horrible, you know, and it gets into our unconscious. And that’s why people have money issues and why people under charge and they, they don’t recognize that right? Their own value. And so giving and receiving are simply two sides of the very same coin. They work in tandem, right? It’s not are you a giver or receiver, you’re a giver, and a receiver. But what you also know is that the giving comes first – this is a a law of life. We plant before we harvest, we sow before we reap, we give before we receive, so as long as we’re focused on giving, giving to the plenty, placing their interests first, coming at it from our authentic core. Now we just have to allow ourselves to receive when we do this, we create that benevolent context for success.

GGGB Intro  01:07

The adventure of entrepreneurship and building a life and business you love, preferably at the same time is not for the faint of heart. That’s why Heather Pearce Campbell is bringing you a dose of Guts, Grit & Great Business™ stories that will inspire and motivate you to create what you want in your business and life. Welcome to the Guts, Grit & Great Business™ podcast where endurance is required. Now, here’s your host, The Legal Website Warrior®, Heather Pearce Campbell.

Heather Pearce Campbell  01:39

Alrighty, welcome. I am Heather Pearce Campbell, The Legal Website Warrior®. I am an attorney and legal coach based here in Seattle, Washington, serving entrepreneurs throughout the US and around the world. I am so excited about today’s conversation. So I want to welcome you to another episode of Guts, Grit & Great Business™. Today we are talking to Bob Burg. Welcome, Bob.

Bob Burg  02:07

Hello. Thanks for having me, Heather. Very exciting.

Heather Pearce Campbell  02:11

Absolutely. I’m so excited to have you today. So for those of you that don’t know about Bob, first of all, I had two friends separately that have different shows that reached out and said, You’ve got to have Bob on your podcast. And so I know when I get it from multiple places I’m like, alright, I’m gonna chase down Bob and we’re gonna get him on the podcast. But for those of you that don’t know, Bob, for over 30 years, Bob Burg has been successfully showing entrepreneurs, leaders and sales professionals how to communicate their value and accelerate their referral business. Although for years he was best known for his sales classic, Endless Referrals, it’s his business parable, the Go Giver, co authored with John David Mann that has created a worldwide movement. While part of a four book series, the Go Giver itself has sold more than 1 million copies and been translated into 30 languages. It was rated number 10 on Inc magazine’s list of the Most Motivational Books Ever Written, and was on HubSpot’s 20 Most Highly Rated Sales Books of All Time. Bob is an advocate, supporter and defender of the free enterprise system, believing that the amount of money one makes is directly proportional to how many people they serve. He is an unapologetic animal fanatic and served on the Board of Directors of Furry Friends Adoption, a clinic in his hometown of Jupiter, Florida. Welcome, Bob. What a lovely introduction.

Bob Burg  03:43

Well, thank you that was lovely how you you said it, you know, we’re about as as opposite directionally in this country as we can possibly be, aren’t we?

Heather Pearce Campbell  03:52

That’s right. You are you are on the other coast and the far corner. Well, I’m so glad to have you today. For folks that haven’t heard from you before. Tell us a little bit about your origins in business

Bob Burg  04:08

I began as a broadcaster first in radio and then television was the late night news guy for a very very small ABC affiliate in the Midwestern United States about halfway between us and I really wasn’t very good at that – it turned out not to be my thing. So I like to say I graduated into sales. And I really loved – I floundered for about the first few months because I had no background in sales. No training. But once I discovered a couple of books and realized all the great materials out there – the this dates me I know – but the cassette tape albums that I used to buy right? Oh don’t even tell me – you’re much too much too young for that. You don’t even know what those are. Maybe your dad and mom were listening.

Heather Pearce Campbell  04:57

Oh, no, no, no. First of all, I look a little young for my age, but I grew up in the days of making mixtapes all the time. Right? So I lived for a good mixtape, I’m with you.

Bob Burg  05:09

Yeah. So you know, I really just got into it – I began reading and learning and studying and I, what I really loved about sales was really the personal development aspect, you know, because you really had to kind of grow on the inside. Yes, sure. Sales is about serving your customers, it’s about bringing value to the marketplace. Absolutely. But in order to do that, you had to be that person who could do that. And that’s where I really just just took in all these books on tape, and I’d go to seminars, and I’d just listen, and it was really such a wonderful experience.

Heather Pearce Campbell  05:46

Hmm, I love that reflection that the fact that sales is all about personal development, and, and the challenge that people face – because I think people hear the word sales, right. And they automatically think of some terrible sales experiences they’ve had where they were on the receiving end of something that felt uncomfortable. But what was it like, as you mentioned, taking a few months to learn sales? What context were you learning sales in? What was that position where you got to learn sales?

Bob Burg  06:22

Actually, I was selling radio and television advertising.

Heather Pearce Campbell  06:27

Yeah, yeah. It related to your work. Yeah.

Bob Burg  06:30

And, you know, to what you said about about sales? Absolutely. You know, I think sales is one of those things – it just brings such a misperception. Because so many things of selling us something, you know, trying to convince someone to buy something they don’t want or need, right. And that’s not selling, that’s called being a con artist. Right? If someone doesn’t need or want it. Selling by definition, Heather, I believe is simply discovering what the other person needs, wants or desires, and helping them to get it. 

Heather Pearce Campbell  07:04

Yes. That’s seling.

Bob Burg  07:06

I’m much more about listening and understanding. And then teaching and guiding than it is, you know, about talking about your product or service. And you know.

Heather Pearce Campbell  07:16

And when you think of it in that conversational framework, right, you’re just having a conversation where you’re being a human and a good listener and learning about, like, we all we all do that. Like my husband has a particular aversion when we talk about sales, he’s like, Oh, I could never, I could never be a salesperson I could. And I was like, What are you talking about? You can talk all day long to your friends or your family about things that you love, or that you think they would love? Right? That would change that, like, we all have it in us. We just don’t think about it in the way you know, we don’t think of it as sales. 

Bob Burg  07:56

I really believe that when most people say they have an aversion to selling or they don’t like selling, it’s not that they don’t like selling it’s that they don’t like what they think selling is. 

Heather Pearce Campbell  08:06


Bob Burg  08:07

Really, you know, the old English route. And my co author of the Go Giver series, John David Mann. He’s the one who found this out. He’s such a, he’s such a words. I mean, I am but he really is right. And it turns out, the Old English root of the word sell is Solange, which which meant to give. So when you’re selling, you’re literally giving Now someone might say, Well, wait a second, isn’t that just semantics? You know, you’re selling? What are you really giving? Well, you let’s say we’re in a conversation with someone you have a prospective customer or client in front of you as an entrepreneur, right? You’re selling, what exactly are you giving? I suggest you’re giving them time, attention, counsel, education, empathy, and most of all, immense value. So when you’re selling you literally are giving.

Heather Pearce Campbell  08:56

Yeah, I love that. Now, I am sure there’s quite a bit that happened between that initial work of learning sales and the book, right? The Go Giver, which obviously, as we talked about, in your introduction, turned into a worldwide movement. Talk to us about how the idea of the book developed like, share with us some some insights from your career and what you learned that led to this book.

Bob Burg  09:24

So when I was when I first started speaking, because eventually I worked my way up years later to sales management, sales leadership position, and I started eventually showing people what what was working for me and for my team, and as they said, Yeah, and in Seinfeld, yada, yada, yada, eventually had a speaking business, right. And a few years into it. I was I was at a conference, the National Speakers Association Conference and a couple of the the older, wiser speakers there said, Bert, you really need to write a book. And I said, Well, I really don’t want to write a book. And so it really does matter, you probably, it’s gonna really help you and your business is gonna help me this year. You know, it’s all the all the reason to write a book. Okay, well, you know, that doesn’t make sense. I’m a, I’m a good student. So I actually wrote a book called endless referrals, subtitle is network your everyday contacts with the sales. This was in the the mid 90s or early 90s. This is back in the day before there were like 1000 billion books on networking. I think I was one of like three authors on networking. So the timing was really good. You know, now, by the way, and there are tons and tons of books on networking. These I love them all. I mean, I learned something from all of them. But back then is just a matter of it was a very uncrowded marketplace. So, so my niche was referrals and so forth. And, and so what the book was really about was, and this will lead into to the Go Giver, but what the book was about was, was sharing a system. And by the way, personally, I define a system as the process of predictably achieving the goal based on a logical and specific set of how to principles. If it’s been proven that by doing a, you’ll get the desired result of B, then you know that all you need to do is a continue to do a and continue to do a and you’ll eventually get the desired result of be that system. And so it was a system for teaching entrepreneurs and salespeople who knew they had a great product or service, they knew it brought immense value to people, but they might not have felt comfortable or confident going out in their local communities, and creating the types of relationships that lead to people wanting to do business with them personally and refer them to others. So that’s what the book was about. It was a how to book. But I’d always since I started reading, you know, when I got into sales, I was loved parables, because parables are stories. And I think we all sort of intuitively know that stories connect at a deeper level than a how to book right. And so and I know, when I whenever I’d read parables, I always felt a connection to the author, even if I didn’t know them, I felt a connection with them, I felt a connection with the, the main character, I felt a connection with the message about what if we could take the basic, the basic premise of endless referrals, which is that all things being equal, people will do business with and refer business to those people they know, like, and trust, which is kind of kind of been the phrase I’ve been known for, since I’ve been speaking, you know, for, for all these years? And what if we could take that and put that into a parable? So the first thing was really coming up with the title. And and, you know, we simply asked, so what is the, the main essence of that salesperson of that entrepreneur who can both quickly and sustainably create those know, like, and trust relationships, and it’s that they’re givers. They’re always looking to give value provide value to others. So coming up with the title, the Go Giver, you know, easy part. But you know what the best thing Heather that I did for that book, was was asking, and when I say asking, I mean pleading with John David Mann, who at the time was the editor in chief of a magazine I used to write for who was very well known within his his particular niche. Now, today, he is a well known author, but back then, and he’s written tons of books with different people. And he just recently had a thriller come out, and he the guy’s great, but but back then few people knew who he was fortunately, I didn’t know. And so you know, I had asked him if he would, if he would work on this, this book with me told him about the idea. And would he be the lead writer and storyteller, believing this guy was the lead writer and storyteller, I’m I’ve done step one, step two, step three, I never could have done this with, but But you know, we collaborated on it. And it really worked out well. And, and that’s really how you know how that happened?

Heather Pearce Campbell  13:51

Well, and the title of it, I think, is just brilliant. I think it can be challenging for people to choose a title that is just so spot on and connects with, like, the core message in a way that yes, I do think that there is some genius in the title and the fact that it became this, you know, worldwide movement. Talk to the naysayers for a moment who, because I think and especially the world that I serve, right, so we talked a little bit about this. I serve experts, information entrepreneurs, people who are running, you know, consulting, services, coaching, they’re building businesses around about event formation that they deliver. Many of them are extraordinarily heart centered entrepreneurs, right? They, their first instinct is to give and doing that in a way that’s not sustainable can really deplete your resources can deplete how you feel about your business can deplete how you feel about you know, networking and establishing new relationships and all of the above. Talk to people who have been in the struggle of over Giving or giving in the wrong way, what’s going on there.

Bob Burg  15:03

So let’s let’s look at a couple of aspects of this, Heather, because this what you brought up is so very important. Let’s look at what what we mean by the term go giver. And then what we don’t mean by perfect, okay? So, go giver simply means it’s simply understanding that shifting your focus. And this is really where it all begins shifting your focus from getting to giving. And when we say giving in this context, we simply mean constantly and consistently providing immense value to others. Understanding that doing so is not only a more fulfilling way of conducting business, it’s the most financially profitable way as well. Now, lest someone think that we’re talking about some magical, mystical, just, oh, just give and that, no, that’s what we’re talking about at all. It’s realizing that it’s actually very rational, very logical, when you’re that person who can take your focus off yourself, and place it on serving others discovering again, what they need, what they want, what they desire, when you’re that person who can take your focus off yourself and place them on helping people solve and overcome their challenges, helping bring them closer to happiness. People feel good about you, people want to get to know you, they like you, they trust you, they want to be in relationship with you, they want to do business with you, they want to tell others about you. This is human nature, and the person who can do this, okay, they understand that money is simply an echo of value, right? It’s the thunder, if you will, to values lightning, which means the you know, the more you focus on providing value to others, the money is simply a very natural, indirect result of that value. You know, I whenever I speak at corporate sales conferences, and I know your you know, your viewers and listeners are more entrepreneurial and so forth. But, but I think we’ll still see the the the point that when I speak at a corporate conference, you know, I’ll look at the salespeople in the audience, and the first thing I say is, nobody’s going to buy from you. Because you have a quota to meet. Right? Okay. Right there knocking we all laugh because we know that’s true, you know, nobody’s gonna buy from you because you need the money. And nobody’s gonna buy from you just because you’re a really nice person, they’re gonna buy from you because they believe that they will be better off by doing so than by not doing so. So first. So that’s what we mean by being a go giver. Now let’s look at the opposite. Okay, being a Go Giver should never be be misconstrued as being in any way congruent with being a doormat. A martyr, or self sacrificial in any way. Absolutely. Not at all. So if you’re feeling as though not you, but I mean, if one is feeling as though they’re being taken advantage of. And and I mean, this, you know, as a pattern, I don’t mean once in a while, I mean, we’re human everything, you know, I mean, is, if it’s a pattern of being taken advantage of, you’re giving yourself away, you’re not right. Well, you’ve got to kind of look at who’s involved every time that happens. And it’s always yield. Right? Yeah. And so, so there’s a reason for it. And so we need to say, Why am I creating a context where people are taking advantage of being I’m allowing it, you know, why am I not setting limits? What is the, you know, what is the payoff? And it’s and then not conscious, but unconscious, you know, what is it that I’m feeling? Am I you know, do I get to be that person who has, you know, I have an excuse, oh, I’m just such a giver, but I’m just not right? Is it? The, you know, you, there’s lots of reasons. So we need to, we need to take that into consideration and ask ourselves why we’re doing that?

Heather Pearce Campbell  19:01

Well, and I do I love that, especially in the context of a pattern that shows up, right, any of us who start to see a pattern in our life, whether it’s with our clients, whether it’s whether it’s with a certain system in our business, something not working, we have a chance to look at it and really fix it. Absolutely. When you’re talking about giving, especially in the context, let’s let’s talk about sales or enrollment conversations, right? That happen in all of these small businesses. Tell us share with us your thoughts on how somebody gives tremendous value without because I feel like there’s a struggle where people give too much in an effort to enroll somebody right to demonstrate like, here’s what it would be like to work with me. Talk to us about how you demonstrate that and give tremendous value without over giving so much that somebody’s like, Oh, I got what I need. I don’t actually need to work with you. 

Bob Burg  19:54

Right. So there are certain aspects like content creation that we all do that that we do that is a strategy, okay, that’s not being a Go Giver, it’s not not being a Go Giver, it’s just simply a strategy we, we provide content, so people can have a chance to get to know what we do. But they know our work, they they have confidence in us in terms of competence, in turn, right in terms of in terms of character in terms of how we present ourselves through that. So that’s, uh, but we know, as we provide this content, that for people to really get the most out of it, they’re going to need to work with us personally, just by the very nature of the thing, it’s not a bait and switch, it’s just, that’s just how easy it is. Okay. It’s like writing a book, you know, person reads a book they they can apply, there should be very value based, just like the content you put out there. But, but, and some people will, by the way, be able to get what they need sort of just from that, and not take it to it. But the people who are really serious about what they want to do in advance, and they’re going to know they need to, okay, it’s the same thing, when you have a consult with someone, maybe you have a free, maybe you’re a coach, and you have a free consult with someone, okay? And you’re providing them with great value based information. While you’re doing it, you’re asking questions to determine discover their need want desire, you’re looking to find where, you know, what happens if they don’t do something different from what they’re doing now? And you ask them the right questions, you know, what would it be? What would your business look like six months from now? If you didn’t do anything about this issue that you’re telling me you have? Okay, so, so we’re painting a picture, and we’re in the sales process as we’re providing them? exceptional value now. So what about that person who kind of keeps coming back to you, and ask you questions, and they’re not, you know, really wanting to pay you for your time? Well, what you’ve got to do, and here’s the thing, if this is something that happens a bunch again, if it’s a pattern, here’s the good news, you know, to expect this, if you know to expect this, you can have a response that’s going to be helpful to everybody involved. So it might be something as simple as, uh, you know, thank you for asking. It sounds like from our conversations, though, you really feel you’ve, you’ve gotten some some good value from this. Yeah, I’ve really enjoyed our conversations. That’s terrific. And, you know, this is actually what I do on a professional level. So if you would like to have a professional relationship with me where I can help you too, but you know, whatever the benefit is Baba Baba, I’d be honored to do so. Is that what you would like to do? Yeah. Okay, you’ve now basically in a very nice, tactful, diplomatic way, let this person know, I’d love to work with you. But at this point, now, it’s going to have to be for a fee. 

Heather Pearce Campbell  22:46

Yeah. Well, it’s, I think that, you know, that example, happens a lot to people in the coaching, consulting, you know, information world, because people do and, and part of it is what you’re talking about, there’s so much content, there’s so many ways that we can serve, there’s so many ways we can support people with information. And at some point, we do need to be having enrolling conversations. And I’m so glad you raised like the the whole crux of this, which for me is about what questions are you asking somebody to get to the right, it goes back to that human element of are you having a conversation, versus just demonstrating value in your services or demonstrating that you’re the expert, right? And I know in your book, and there’s a lot there, so we won’t go over at all? But could you quickly walk us through the five laws that you cover in that book?

Bob Burg  23:43

Yeah, the laws themselves are the laws of value compensation influence authenticity, and receptivity, the law of value, which says your true worth is determined by how much more you give in value, then you take in payment. Now that can be very easily misconstrued, I get more in value than I take in payment. Now that sounds like a recipe for bankruptcy. It’s simply understanding the difference between price and value. Yeah, price is $1 figure value is the relative worth or desirability of a thing to the end user or Beholder if you have a coaching client, and you charge them over the course of the time, it will just name around figure $25,000 Okay, for however long that was and and they’re able to increase their business $200,000. Well, you’ve given them more in value than what you took in payment, but you made a very healthy profit, which you should because it was worth it to you to invest your time, resources, knowledge, wisdom, and so forth, in that so that’s all that that means. So in other words, both both parties profit because both parties come away better off afterwards than they were before. The law of compensation says your your income is determined by how many people you serve and how well you serve them. So we’re Law Number one, the law of value is all about your position. Income. Law number two is all about how many lives you impact with that value. So we could say, exceptional value law number one, and significant reach law number two equals very high compensation. Law. Number three, the law of influences your influence is determined by how abundantly you place other people’s interests first, no, not in a way that’s self sacrificial, but simply understanding as Joe, the protege. And the story learned from several of the mentors. And we talked about earlier, the golden rule of business of sales is that again, all things being equal people will do business with and refer business to those people they know like and trust. Well, you know, whether there’s no faster, more powerful or more effective way to elicit those types of feelings toward you in others, than by genuinely moving from an eye focus or me focus to that other focus or is Sam, one of the mentors in the story advise Joe, it’s making your win all about the other person’s win. Law number four, the law of authenticity says the most valuable gift you have to offer is yourself, Deborah Davenport, the mentor in this part of the story shared a great less than that all the skills in the world, the sales skills, technical skills, people skills, as important as they are, and they are indeed all very important. They’re also all for naught if you don’t come at it from your true, authentic core. But when you do when you show up as yourself, day after day, week, after week, month after month, people feel good about you, they feel very comfortable with you, they feel very safe with you, and why wouldn’t they? They know who they’re getting. Right. Yeah. And then law number five is the law of receptivity. This one sort of ties it all together. This says the key to effective giving is to stay open to receiving this really means nothing more than understanding that yeah, you breathe out, well, you’ve also got to breathe in. It’s not one or the other. We breathe out carbon dioxide, we breathe in oxygen we breathe out, which is giving we breathe in, which is receiving, giving and receiving are not opposite concepts. Despite the horrible messages of lack and anti prosperity we get from the world around us. It’s just horrible, you know, and, and, and it gets into our unconscious. And that’s why people have money issues and why people under charge, and they they don’t recognize that right? Their own value. And so giving and receiving are simply two sides of the very same coin, they work in tandem, right? It’s not are you a giver, or receiver, you’re a giver, and a receiver. But what you also know is that the giving comes first this is a a law of life. We plant before we harvest we sow before we reap we give before we receive. So as so long as we’re focused on giving, giving to the plenty placing Varick was first coming at it from our authentic core. Now we just have to allow ourselves to receive when we do this, we create that benevolent context for success.

Heather Pearce Campbell  28:13

I love that entire framework and the way that you describe the concepts including the the balance between you know that the those concepts the being able to receive, as well as give I know so many people that can give in a really challenged when it comes to receiving. Right, but there has to be that balance, and especially when you’re talking about in the context of business. 

Bob Burg  28:36

Oh, there has to be sure. 

Heather Pearce Campbell  28:38

Yeah, absolutely. We’re where do you find that people are most challenged when you get? 

Bob Burg  28:44

Absolutely. Is it their love receptivity receptivity or more notes from people that that chapter is what allowed them to finally see that? Yeah, it’s okay to receive. It’s a good thing to receive. Love that. But you know, but I also had to believe that, that while we covered it on a surface level in the book, there’s a lot more to it than that. And that’s why I’m a big believer in making a study of prosperity. And there are great prosperity teachers and speakers and authors out there from Randy Gage, Sharon Lechter, to Ellen Rogen, to Ken onda. To, to you know, the late Bob Proctor and David Nagel. And there’s so many great great speakers and teachers and bloggers and posters. You know, I just think it’s important because again, we get all the horrible anti prosperity messages from everywhere around us, gets into your head and the insidious part is it’s your unconscious that it gets into

Heather Pearce Campbell  29:44

That’s right, And depending on your background, it’s it starts when you’re teeny tiny

Bob Burg  29:49

Can be a matter of upbringing and environments, schooling, news, media, television movie, every everywhere. Exactly.

Heather Pearce Campbell  29:56

Yeah, it’s huge. What was the one piece of advice that you Received if you were to choose one along your journey long before you wrote this book that you found, especially looking backwards, most valuable?

Bob Burg  30:08

Well, I think it was when the day I, you know, I was in a real sales slump. And in a guy at the company, an older guy, he wasn’t even in the sales department, but he but he was one of these guys, he you know, he didn’t say much, but when he did, it was usually profound. And I think he saw me as sort of like Joe in the story that I would write with John David Mann, 25-30 years later, whatever he saw me is that young, ambitious up and coming but very frustrated young salesperson who, whose focus was in the wrong place. And, and he said, Berg, you know, if you want to make a lot of money in sales, he said, don’t have making money as your target, your target is serving others. Now, when you hit the target, you’ll get a reward. And that reward will come in the form of money, and you can do with that money, whatever you choose. But never forget, you said, the money is simply the reward for hitting the target. It isn’t the target itself, your target is serving others.

Heather Pearce Campbell  31:09

I love that I read a book, I think it might have been a Nordstrom way. But there was a phrase that stuck with me about like, if your business is just all about making money, that’s a bad business. You know, it’s not a sustainable business. And I think even from a personal standpoint, it doesn’t become sustainable. So I love I love that takeaway. So Bob, where for folks that are listening with us today, where do you like for them to find you online?

Bob Burg  31:37

Best place is just my website, which is There’s a whole bunch of resources there, people can check out if they’d like,

Heather Pearce Campbell  31:45

Awesome and we will definitely share that as well as any social media links you have for us in the show notes. So you’re welcome to pop over to But what final bit of advice do you have for for folks that are with us today?

Bob Burg  32:01

Um, you know, I’d say when it comes right down to it, it’s it’s really how much we can not not deny ourselves interest, because that’s part of human nature, but suspend willingly suspend our self interest. And really, really just focus on bringing immense value to others. And again, there’s nothing so sacrificial about it. Because the degree you do that, that is degree that you develop that know like, and trust relationship. And it’s the relationship that drives the business.

Heather Pearce Campbell  32:38

Well, and I love the emphasis on the point that it’s not self sacrificial to do that. I think people sometimes get that wrong. Yeah, Bob, thank you for being with us today. It’s such a pleasure to connect. I’m so grateful for your time and I just adore your message. I love your book, everybody needs to pop over and get a copy. Thank you, Bob. Thank you.

GGGB Outro  33:03

Thank you for joining us today on the Guts, Grit & Great Business™ podcast. We hope that we’ve added a little fuel to your tank, some coffee to your cup and pep in your step to keep you moving forward in your own great adventures. For key takeaways, links to any resources mentioned in today’s show and more, see the show notes which can be found at Be sure to subscribe to the podcast and if you enjoyed today’s conversation, please give us some stars and a review on Apple podcast, Spotify or wherever you get your podcast so others will find us too. Keep up the great work you’re doing in the world and we’ll see you next week.