March 28th, 2023
With Ian Garlic, the CEO of authenticWEB, a top-ranked SEO company, who is an expert in internet marketing. With a vast experience of working with some of the world’s largest organizations, Ian has become a renowned consultant and marketer in the industry. He has spoken on internet marketing at several prestigious associations such as the Manhattan Association of Realtor, New York State Trial Lawyers Association, Nassau County Bar Association, and Hispanic Bar Association of Central Florida.
Before he delved into internet marketing, Ian had diverse work experiences in the restaurant industry, sales, trading, and commercial real estate in New York City, which he believes gave him a business background and an edge in his career. Ian’s passion for business, film, and the web has led him to use video production as a means to tell the stories of great businesses. His knowledge of SEO, social media, and website design has enabled him to better understand the channels for telling compelling stories in various ways.
Ian is a Rollins College graduate and has learned a lot from reading, doing, making mistakes, and correcting them. He believes that internet marketing is a field where constant learning and improvement are key to success. He loves to educate people through and about the mediums of film, the web, and business. In Ian’s view, stories rule our entire lives: how we listen to them, how we tell them, and the stories we tell ourselves.
In this podcast, Ian shares his insights on how to effectively connect with your audience and build a meaningful relationship through the use of client stories. Ian challenges the common practice of using testimonials and highlights the power of storytelling in capturing your audience’s attention. Ian also dives into the pitfalls of adopting an advertising mentality and why it’s crucial to steer clear from it. Plus, you won’t want to miss the two important keys Ian shares for creating a compelling story arc in your videos.
So, grab a cup of coffee and tune in to this episode for some valuable takeaways on the art of storytelling in marketing.
Biggest takeaways (or quotes) you don’t want to miss:
- What is an advertising mentality?
- Why you have to tell the story at the right moment.
- Client stories vs testimonials.
- Two important things beside having a good story arc to a video.
- “Being in businesses is tough… it’s a constant battle.”
- Why is it important to dedicate 30 minutes a week to storytelling?
“In the end, the number one thing besides the goal is having someone that cares both about your business and about the person on the other side.”-Ian Garlic
Check out these highlights:
- 04:28 What do people usually get wrong about video testimonials and video client stories?
- 09:39 Ian walks us through the things you need to know if you’re trying to create client stories.
- 27:58 What Ian wishes people knew about YouTube that they don’t.
- 35:31 Ian shares the “gutsiest” or “grittiest” thing he has ever done in his life.
- 36:38 How Ian got experience working with law firms and small law firms.
How to get in touch with Ian:
On social media:
Learn more about Ian, by visiting his website here.
Imperfect Show Notes
We are happy to offer these imperfect show notes to make this podcast more accessible to those who are hearing impaired or those who prefer reading over listening. While we would love to offer more polished show notes, we are currently offering an automated transcription (which likely includes errors, but hopefully will still deliver great value), below:
Ian Garlic 00:00
No, no. I mean, you’re like, I don’t want to be on video. I’m like, well, they everyone kind of expects it. Now it doesn’t have to be tons of video. You have a lot of good customer service, but they want to know you beforehand. Because if I have this known entity of someone, I’ve know what they’re gonna look like and sound like and when I get a feel for them, and I’m gonna spend $10,000 with them or someone I have no idea with, I have to get on a random zoom call with. We’re going to choose
GGGB Intro 00:23
The adventure of entrepreneurship and building a life and business you love, preferably at the same time is not for the faint of heart. That’s why Heather Pearce Campbell is bringing you a dose of guts, grit and great business stories that will inspire and motivate you to create what you want in your business and life. Welcome to the Guts, Grit and Great Business® podcast where endurance is required. Now, here’s your host, The Legal Website Warrior®, Heather Pearce Campbell.
Heather Pearce Campbell 00:52
Welcome. I’m super excited to be with you here today. I am Heather Pearce Campbell, The Legal Website Warrior®. I’m an attorney and legal coach supporting online information entrepreneurs throughout the US and around the world. Welcome to another episode of Guts, Grit and Great Business®. You are in for a super treat today. We have Ian Garlic on the show. Welcome Ian.
Ian Garlic 01:19
Thank you. I’m so happy to be here. I’m gonna use my NPR voice today.
Heather Pearce Campbell 01:22
That radio voice, it’s so good. Well, I am super excited. We’re overdue. I think I reached out to you quite a while ago. And as the case I mean, it just happens right? Emails go wherever they go and get lost. And so I’ve had to ping me a couple times. And here we are. And I know I call mine too, which is why I’m pretty persistent with people so super happy to have you here. For folks that don’t know Ian, you can find him at Ian Garlic everywhere. Video testimonials stink, video case stories are what your business needs. Garlic can stink but hopefully Ian Garlic does not. He has produced over 10,000 videos including video case stories for clients from small law firms to Fortune 50 companies. Ian has been the video strategist for business leaders such as Gino Wickman, Fran Tarkenton and really quick did I say your name the right way at the started? I screwed up again.
Ian Garlic 02:26
Yeah, I don’t mind.
Heather Pearce Campbell 02:28
My brain. I was like, Did I say it? It’s Ian Garlic folks, just in case you’re wondering.
Ian Garlic 02:32
It’s fine, you can call me Ian.
Heather Pearce Campbell 02:34
No, your name is Ian and it’s great. And my brain is having a flashback like wait, did I do it the wrong way this time? Okay,
Ian Garlic 02:42
Make sure to leave that in there. Please.
Heather Pearce Campbell 02:44
I will, you know, I’ll tell you, I’m all about being real on this show. I launched this show, post pandemic with two kids at home full-time and one of my children is very ADHD and the other one was two, at the time. So you can imagine how fun that was everyday recording and being like, I don’t know what’s gonna happen in the background. So to my podcast
Ian Garlic 03:10
That would draw in viewers, like you said, it’s like, you have to wait and see what happens.
Heather Pearce Campbell 03:14
It’s such a mystery. I know it’s such a mystery. So Ian has been the video strategist for business leaders such as Gino Wickman, Fran Tarkenton, Jason Swank, and many others. He has also hosted over 400 episodes of the Garlic Marketing Show. If you’re looking for customer stories, or YouTube strategy, call videocasestory.com If you need something reached from a high place, call Ian. Ian, are you tall? How tall are you?
Ian Garlic 03:45
Heather Pearce Campbell 03:46
Wow! You’re not just like little bit tall. You’re officially tall. Wow. Well, that’s awesome. Yeah, too bad you’re not my neighbor. So your company is called what? Video case story, video case story and video case story helps clients collect amazing client stories, craft beautiful videos and then create a strategy for using those everywhere to draw in more amazing clients. Well, let’s just start with this Ian, what do people usually get wrong about video testimonials and video client stories?
Ian Garlic 04:27
Right? Like my big thing. The reason I say testimonials think is because the number one I have a list of like 40 reasons. But the number one reason that testimonials think is that about you? No one cares about you. No one cares about your business. They care about the people you’ve helped. Why are you they like them? What problem did they have? How did you solve that problem and not just how the results but the transformation that you got? They care about when’s the last time you saw someone cry on a testimonial. Never write it. Do you ever get excited to see video testimonials that type of website, you’re like, Oh, let me watch that. But we’ve got stories that I’ve shown, like I’ve shown stories of our lawyer clients in marketing groups and feel like, I need to finish watching that. It frames everything in a different way. If I ask you for a testimonial, Heather, and you’d be like, Okay, I’m gonna talk about Ian, he was great to be on the show, or, you know, he is really tall, it would talk a lot of people get worried to have your best clients be asking for a testimonial, they’re worried that they’re gonna say the wrong thing. And they’re going to talk about you. And it’s like, oh, you know, Ian, it’s great, blah, blah, blah, and no one cares about that. And what I think is, the worst thing about testimonials is they check the box, everyone knows we should be using customer stories, everyone knows you should be listening your customers, everyone knows that’s the key to it. But when you check the box of testimonials, you move on to the next thing, I’m gonna go try figure out the new Facebook ad strategy or YouTube, I’m gonna figure out OS 14, if you have just amazing customer stories, and you just put them on all the platforms, and they’re really amazing, and you design them for where they are in the customer journey, because you can take one person’s story and chop it up into 10 different ways. If that’s all you did, you would win. But when you go testimonials, 20 people saying how great you are, and then people drown it out. And you’ve lost all this data, you’ve lost all this information. You’ve lost all these 80+ things you can do with customer stories. So that’s why I think just starting with testimonials is number one. Number two, I call it the bad lawyer strategy. Imagine if we agreed customer stories are number one thing on a website, right? I mean, number one thing for your business, your content, your marketing, copy, your conversion, improve the conversion website, Panda Doc, I had them on the podcast, and they said, video on proposals increases conversion rate 32%. Right, that’s a 32% raise just by going boom, a story on here. So we have all these ways to use it. But the reason I called the bad lawyer syndrome, imagine it’s so important, right? You’re in this trial, your business is a trial. And you’re sitting there, and it’s the trial of your business. Either it’s going to succeed after the trial, or you’re going to lose everything. And you’re waiting for your lawyer to walk in. And instead of your lawyer walking in there, paralegal walks in. And maybe even the paralegal and assistant walks in. And they’re like, What the heck, like, I just downloaded these questions from the internet. For that first witness. You’d be friggin upset when it you. But that’s what everyone does with their customers stores. If they even get questions, they download some questions and go here. Can you answer these on video?
Heather Pearce Campbell 07:46
Right, well, and how many times what I was gonna say is how many times do you like for business owners listening? Have you reached out like asking for a testimonial? And somebody responds like, what do you want me to say? Right? Like they’re like, nobody knows how to do them the right way.
Ian Garlic 08:03
No, and it starts with strategy, but then you it has to be a fundamental of your business. It has to be something you regularly do. One of my favorite stories, like of all time is Walt Disney story. And I just love him. But you know, up until three months before he died, he was in the last year of his life, he was incredibly sick. But he was the most famous person on the planet. Like, he wasn’t ever you don’t we forget that. There are only three channels. And every Sunday, everyone watched Walt. But he would walk around the park still and talk to the people in the park and ask them questions about their experience. Ask them what they like, watch them, pay attention to them. And that’s what built that business. Steve Jobs. Every great business is built on the back of this and the strategy. And I can only imagine if Walt had the ability to collect those stories, and use the Internet, what he would have done, right, but we have that ability. And if you start and make this a fundamental of your business, it will transfer I’ve able I’m able to answer 80% of people’s marketing questions after talking to their customers. I’m sorry, I get excited about it.
Heather Pearce Campbell 09:14
So good. It’s so good. So certainly, there’s probably a way to do stories the wrong way. Right. And there’s a way to do them the right way or closer to the right way. When people are thinking like okay, shifting from testimonials to stories, what do we need to know about stories, what we should be looking for trying to create, ask for, like, walk us through that.
Ian Garlic 09:39
So a few things to remember is first of all, you have to decide what you want to do with the stories. And if it’s improve your positioning, that should be across the stories, but also it might get to go. Do I want to have a YouTube strategy around this? Do I want to improve this piece of service? Do I want to increase my prices? Do I want to get certain type of clients Do I want to close clients faster? Now the stories can do all that. But you really want to go with that intent. So when you go to talk to someone, you’re really talking about that piece, maybe there’s an objection that you get all the time, like you’re too expensive way to attorney client that everyone said it was too expensive. We went got stories to explain why that was worth it. You know, it’s like, you get someone crying, saying, Oh, my God, I gotta jail. I was thought I was gonna go to jail. And because I invested in this, I’m not going to jail. You find that story. So having that goal before you ask the questions is absolutely crucial. And then having someone interview the people, right, plan the questions out and have someone interview and talk to them. I get very frustrated, cuz everyone wants just send the questions. Even if you never get conversation, you’re not going to get something like this.
Heather Pearce Campbell 10:50
Who know and who loves to sit down and just like record in front of like, I owe because my next question was going to be how do you help people do it in a way that is, that feels easy, right? Because that’s a big ask to like, send somebody like, Hey, could you just make a video, it seems it seems small, it’s not small. Anybody who’s on the receiving end of Lego, I gotta go make a video that could be on this person’s website, or wherever, they’re not thrilled about it, even if they really like. you.
Ian Garlic 11:18
No, no, and by having a good interviewer, that’s one thing. I’m really proud of our team. We have people that are great interviewers, they know where it’s gonna go. They know what we’re looking for, they know where to lead the conversation, but I get so many compliments from other marketers and other business owners. Like, I got compliments from my clients about your interviewers, like they had a great time. And, you know, I think some of that comes from I love interviewing we’ve been doing for years. And the podcast has taught me a lot, and we train a lot of people. But in the end, the number one thing besides goal is having someone that cares both about your business and about the person on the other side, because we can read that, right? And if you get someone that you’re like, oh, this person cares about me, you’ll tell your story.
Heather Pearce Campbell 12:03
Yeah. Well, and certainly I would imagine all that experience helps of like how to ask questions, in a way, I mean, in my lawyer hats coming on, that actually gets the answer that you want, right? Or lead somebody to the place that you want, in a very natural way versus something that feels clunky, or cumbersome or not quite it.
Ian Garlic 12:25
Yeah, exactly. And you have to know where you’re going, but also be open. When you find that thing that you can tell something shifted in what they’re talking about, you’re like, let me dig deeper there. And that’s when the magic happens. And that’s why, you know, I think the two most important things, besides having a good story arc to a video are moments and emotions, is when someone talks about the moment this thing happened. And they describe it right. And it’s like someone could say, Heather prevented me from having a lawsuit, like, Okay, that’s great. But as I remember, you know, I remember when I got that phone call that we were gonna get sued. And then I was so scared, and I everything I had done with Heather, up to this moment prepared me for that. So I wasn’t scared in that moment of relief, that the lawsuit went away, it was amazing. You have to find that you. People aren’t gonna say that. But if you can get those moments and emotions, then you make amazing videos to get people crying. And I’d love to get people to cry on video.
Heather Pearce Campbell 13:29
Don’t we all? I mean, who doesn’t love to have a good crisis? Like my son, I joke, my sister, I don’t know if she would say this to a friend, somebody like, nobody looks good when they cry, right, like, stop it, you’re on camera. But the point is, I think so important that on the receiving side of that message, that is what we relate to as humans is understanding a moment in time understanding the emotion and relating to that, in a way that actually moves us very different than just hearing somebody just say something kind of flatly that’s not really relatable because it doesn’t get into story.
Ian Garlic 14:09
And I’m super like marketing and science nerd. And one of my good friends Paul Zak, Dr. Paul Zak wrote this incredible book called neuro economics where he have you heard of it? No, but I love the title. He’s amazing. You should have him on your podcast. He just published a new book. He does all this crazy stuff around like, and he’s just a great guy. But he does all this stuff around like they measured oxytocin levels and people at certain moments, and they have a device now that they can they measure audiences and their and their oxytocin and their biofeedback. But empathy is the mix of oxytocin and cortisol, your friend.
Heather Pearce Campbell 14:50
Ian, by the way, says that knowing the truth of my relationship to cortisol right now, which is that it’s not really my friend. We were way too close for my connection going on.
Ian Garlic 15:01
A mix of cortisol and oxytocin. You know what that causes when those two are mixed together. And out, it’s empathy. And so interesting, they did a study, and they showed a picture of video of a kid and his dad, it was a flat story. And then they made the story, very empathetic. And I won’t get into story saucer cry. But after that, so they rose peoples, they got the oxytocin and cortisol levels to rise, and increase the empathy, the chemical empathy. And after that, people, I think, were 30% more likely, and that stat might be way off, but it was significant. To make a positive action on anything. So if it was completely unrelated donation or anything, they were more likely to do something. So think about that. Like we’re trying to do all these internet marketing tricks, and they’re like, here’s the latest headline, and here’s the latest subject lines. Like, if you tell a great story, and then ask someone to do something, you’re gonna have a 30% better chance that they’re gonna do it. Now on top of that, we remember stories we think and stories, you know?
Heather Pearce Campbell 16:09
Relate to them if somebody relatable like…
Ian Garlic 16:12
Exactly. And what’s less case study, remember?
Heather Pearce Campbell 16:17
White Paper? Exactly.
Ian Garlic 16:20
I can’t wait to read that white paper. But a story we will remember. And we’ll remember those people. And I mean, I was just doing sorry to talk too much, but I was just doing a…
Heather Pearce Campbell 16:31
Podcasts are totally not about talking.
Ian Garlic 16:36
I just get excited on this topic. We were just doing a case story. It’s a long form one, it was a healthcare fraud case, not exciting. But the case itself was you’d probably like it. But you know, we did 40 minutes interview with this guy. And he was hilarious. Not intentionally hilarious, just probably one of the worst. He was like, very, I can’t say much about him, because the case stories can come out. But anyways, he’d be the worst client to have to put up on trial. But anyways, he told the story. And then we went to do the storyboard. And I remembered every single moment of the story of the 40 minutes. And like, we need this detail in there. Like how do you remember that? Because it’s a story, right? You remember stories, and all the science behind it, the key to it is make it a treat it like a fundamental of your business. Practice it every day, collect them every day, you’ve got to go out there and practice those free throws. Practice that potting. Right. And you’ve got to do that. And that’s what I tell people, like just make it a priority. Because it’s one of those things that your business won’t go away right away if you don’t do it. And it won’t magically mean it can magically sometimes transform. Generally it won’t. But that trajectory will change.
Heather Pearce Campbell 17:52
Totally. What is it about storytelling that intimidates people? Right. I think people recognize when they hear when they hear a great story, I think when you turn the table and because I think we hear this right, like you have to be able to tell a good story. And suddenly, it’s like your brain freezes up piglet. Ooh, it makes a good stunt. You know, I feel like it like people get blocked around it, like feeling like they have the confidence to know what it takes to tell a good story.
Ian Garlic 18:22
I mean, once again, it’s fundamentals. It’s practice, right? It’s collecting them, you have to have a collection on them. It’s building up the ability to do it. So that you asked me a question. Like I probably told like seven stories, right? And throughout, it’s not because I had them plan it just because you build up a collection of them, you get used to it. I think the biggest thing though, on the internet is and this is the biggest problem it but you know, the number one reason why people buy make a decision.
Heather Pearce Campbell 18:55
Why they make a decision, that’s gonna say, either well, I don’t know, in my head, I’m thinking like, either it’s a fear based or pain based trigger, right? Or the opposite right there. It’s a pleasure, like solve a major problem, but still kind of relation to pain base, it’s going to reverse the pain.
Ian Garlic 19:16
And because of the level of those are decided by the situation, the moments, we have to speak to their moments, right? We were talking to earlier about, you know, the kids going to school, and how you’re thinking when your lawyer hat, we changed so much throughout the day. And you’re talking about you know, how your motions changed. The people decide because of the moment so it and we know that intuitively as people write the story. We’re going to you know, if we were out for drinks, you’d be telling me a different story than you would tell me at the board. Right hopefully, there’s those people that are really awkward storytellers that will tell the story anywhere. But we know the moment and then people get on and they want. And they know also what they want the story to do. Do I want the story to make someone laugh? Do I want to make a story just like me. We don’t we get on the internet. And we’re like, I want the story that’s gonna make me a ton of money. Talk to everyone, and make me rich right now. That’s not how it works. And that’s where you get intimidated, because you’re…
Heather Pearce Campbell 20:22
Too much, putting too much weight on eat on it. Yeah, I see that.
Ian Garlic 20:27
Yeah. And you’re not telling the story for the moment. You don’t know who you’re talking to. And you don’t know what you want to do. And also, you and I think a lot of people make the mistake of seeing, you know, get the advertising mentality. And they see like a great story on an ad. I’m like, well, they have to generalize that ad to everyone, you on the internet. And that’s why actually, we found that the business was I realized when YouTube was purchased by Google, and like, we’re gonna be able to tell the story. And this was like, 15 years ago, and I had this insight. I don’t say that, because I want to show off. I say that because it took a long time for people to realize this. But we you can tell the story, at the exact moment to the right person, because they’re typing that thing into Google, and you can have that story show up to answer their question. Think about that, how powerful that is. Yeah, and YouTube will actually reward you. Because if you tell a great story, you’re gonna get the view time, you’re gonna get the click, you’re gonna have the right people watching the whole story. And percent view time and total view time are the two top factors that are going to get your YouTube video ranking.
Heather Pearce Campbell 21:37
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Ian Garlic 23:27
Hmm, so yeah, there you go.
Heather Pearce Campbell 23:30
There it is. It’s so important. So what this brings to mind though, is and I heard you say that you need a collection of stories. You need to be telling them probably everywhere in your business and your conversations and your marketing and your get to know you calls everywhere.
Ian Garlic 23:47
Oh, yeah, we actually developed a tool. We call it the case story tackle box. And you know, I’ll give people access to I will put up a page for you. videocasestory.com/gggb
Heather Pearce Campbell 23:56
GGGB. Guts, great, great business. I know three G’s and a B.
Ian Garlic 24:02
Yes. And we will put it up there. And we’ll put the tackle box on there. But it’s a tool we developed for that purpose. Because I would talk to people I’m like, what stories you have powerful stories, and they’re like, oh, they wouldn’t know them. And or they’d be like, I had a I have this video somewhere. I’m like, that’s like me saying, Yeah, I have like $100,000 a stack of $1,000 bills. And there’s a bottom of my closet. Yeah, I mean, that would be great. If they even knew it was at the bottom of their closet. They just have no idea where it was like and so we start to organize them making a tool. So when you start a marketing project, that’s where you go, you put the stories there, but also we have people using it to train their sales team. You have a new salesperson coming on, you’re like here’s my stories use these. Yeah, you have a new marketing team. Let’s start with these stories. Here you go and we organize them all and you have all your hooks and angles, all your copywriting stuff all in one place. So but because you have to have a collection.
Heather Pearce Campbell 24:59
Yeah, so good. So I’m gonna switch gears a little bit because I want to know more about your personal story. How did you get into this area of work?
Ian Garlic 25:10
It’s a long story. Well,
Heather Pearce Campbell 25:11
The long story, what’s your favorite part of the journey?
Ian Garlic 25:16
I’ve always kind of been in marketing, I grew up in kind of a marketing household. My parents were entrepreneurs. And they would always be telling stories. So I kind of, like I’m from a big family. So it was always storytelling. I like big my mom was one of 11. So and tall. But, you know, we told stories, crazy things would always happen. So everyone would tell stories. But then I got into, you know, I didn’t want to into business, I didn’t think and I but I ended up in an economics degree and I got to work for a hedge fund. And I got to New York City, doing commercial real estate. And then I realized that I like working with people. I like helping people. I like doing that things. I know how to make a lot of money. And but if you’re just sitting there in a hole making money, it’s not a lot of fun. So and, you know, I started to learn more and more about marketing. I think my first real I tried to do marketing, but my first real marketing book was tipping point by Malcolm Gladwell. And I was like, this is it, right? And I love Malcolm Gladwell. And I started, read Seth Godin. And I got into a became marketing consultant, New York City. Because I’d done a lot of stuff in commercial real estate using marketing, like 2004 or five, I was using LinkedIn to get in with people, because no one’s…
Heather Pearce Campbell 26:34
It’s a natural fit for you. Sounds like…
Ian Garlic 26:36
Yeah. Well, LinkedIn was amazing back then. Because if you got a LinkedIn message in 2005, you’re like, what is this?
Heather Pearce Campbell 26:45
Ian Garlic 26:47
And I got like, the heads of companies to talk to me, like, hey, and they’re like, how do I even know LinkedIn could do this? And then, you know, I worked for Thomson Reuters big company. And then when Google was, like I said, I was an SEO and kind of into video was getting bigger. And then YouTube was purchased by Google. And that’s how I was like, This is it. And I’m like, and we started to do a lot of other kinds of videos. But I realized quickly that we were always using case stories, but that this was the most crucial part, always. And when we didn’t start with it. It wouldn’t work as well. Like, you get marketing messages. But then every time I talk to clients, I’m like, there’s your keyword. There’s your positioning statement. There’s this, there’s this. And people after a while, I would make people cry, and not in a bad way. And I kind of known for that. And they would call us up and be like, hey, I need it to come out. I’ve got this great story.
Heather Pearce Campbell 27:43
So I really need somebody to cry over here.
Ian Garlic 27:45
Heather Pearce Campbell 27:49
What do you wish people knew about YouTube that they don’t?
Ian Garlic 27:55
That’s your question. I think everyone needs to be YouTube first strategy. It’s your kids… Are your kids on YouTube a lot?
Heather Pearce Campbell 28:06
Oh, my gosh, my kids. This is a perfect story talking about YouTube. My kids knew there was a YouTube kids before I knew that there was a YouTube kids, right? They found it. They figured it out on my phone. And I’m not even joking. They were like, I think Aiden was two or three at the time. Oh, yeah. he knew how to use apps and icons. And like was, I remember the first time I moved an icon on a desktop in the late 90s. I thought I’d broken the computer. You know, I didn’t know what I just done. Like, it’s so crazy. The level of the difference just in how adapt right these children are. So yeah, they know all about YouTube. And I will also tell you, it’s a daily struggle to keep it.
Ian Garlic 28:49
Yeah, it’s addictive, and it’s probably on your TV. Like when you don’t want it to be your last night
Heather Pearce Campbell 28:54
My husband threatened for whatever number of time I’m gonna take YouTube off of all these devices. Could we do even know how to do that? No, no, right.
Ian Garlic 29:05
And if you Google stuff, you show up YouTube videos show up in there. And what’s the most attractive thing on their YouTube video can be way down, and people click through. And everyone’s, it’s number two most used search engine, its fastest growing platform. We spent so much time on it. I mean, every people of every age my, you know, one of my coordinators, Danica at her parents, you know, want to be in their 70s You know, like, we’re gonna be YouTube influencers, right?
Heather Pearce Campbell 29:35
I love it. I love it.
Ian Garlic 29:37
So everyone’s there. But it’s not just about influence. It’s everyone’s going there to research you. They’re going there to learn more. I think everyone needs to treat their YouTube channel like a website. And in I’m always scared of platforms going away.
Heather Pearce Campbell 29:54
That’s it. I know, the attorney in me, the risk assessor is like, oh, you know, yeah, building your house on rented property.
Ian Garlic 30:02
Actually, my first SEO book was a kid’s book about SEO. And it was exactly that, like, hey, you need to own your SEO. But with our kids on YouTube, us on YouTube and Google doing such a good job of it, I don’t see it going away anytime soon. Yeah, that’s like being the new Google who’s gonna do that? No one. I mean, something might come up one day, we’re like, plugged into our brain or something. But YouTube, you need to have a strategy around it, because people are gonna do the research on it. You need to have it needs to be placed, because it’s still everyone isn’t there yet. Right? Everyone’s there. But every business isn’t there completely.
Heather Pearce Campbell 30:40
I think the awareness is there. I don’t think the action is there yet, right? It’s still like, how do you do it in the right way? How do you have the strategy that works for you? Because I still think video by and large, unless you have a good budget for it, it feels really overwhelming to a lot of people in business.
Ian Garlic 30:59
But it’s such an investment. We have clients, I’ve used our videos for 10 years, literally. And you know, if you get to break it down, now you’re at like 30 cents a day or something, right per video. And I got a client last week that claimed a video case story seven years ago, just landed them a $15,000. Patient. And it builds, it builds and builds and builds on to on top of itself, you build subscribers, it’s gonna be harder and more expensive to get subscribers, it’s gonna be harder and more expensive to get SEO. But right now, it’s still an opportunity, huge opportunity to build your authority. And even if you don’t, you can build that micro authority. So when people go through there, they watch a few of your videos, it’s it’s kind of a meeting point, like they go your website, it feels like, I don’t know exactly how this works. YouTube, I know exactly how it works. And we have to treat it as this awareness place, a place that we’re gonna get leads from awareness and bottom of funnel. Because people you put your process videos, people are gonna go there when they make the decision. I have clients that have landed like airlines as clients because of their YouTube strategy.
Heather Pearce Campbell 32:08
Right? Even before we went live you saying the number of clients that have shown up and said, somebody was watching their channel for ages? Are you even right? And like showing up to your business, and you don’t know who they are? And they feel like they know you already. Like it’s a relationship builder, without the one on one time of actually building that relationship?
Ian Garlic 32:29
Yep. Yeah. And I used to have it and that’s exactly it. And here’s the one thing that’s changed, and I say YouTube’s dead for this reason, the old YouTube strategy of the Field of Dreams. If you build it, they will come. No, you can’t just put videos up anymore. You have to tell stories, you have to have engaging videos, because you’re battling cats, babies and boobs.
Heather Pearce Campbell 32:50
So really, I appreciate you pointing out that last one. It’s a true story. Yeah. You are. Oh, I don’t I know it. Yeah.
Ian Garlic 33:02
And what if you get better and better at it, you make it a fundamental, you’re gonna win. You’re gonna I don’t have a single client who has at least 20 good YouTube videos. That doesn’t say it’s a great investment.
Heather Pearce Campbell 33:15
I love that. Yeah. Well, and whatever leads to know that you’re putting out content and a relationship building asset and telling stories the right way, right, because you’ve got professional help. I mean, even that, just the peace of mind around knowing that because that is still an energy expenditure, right? Yeah. And but doing it in a way that doesn’t waste your time or waste waste that investment. So yeah, it’s
Ian Garlic 33:45
And if you’re a service based business, people are buying you.
Heather Pearce Campbell 33:49
Right? And you can’t opt out of that you can’t get around it.
Ian Garlic 33:53
No, no, I mean, you’re like, I don’t want to be on video. I’m like, Well, everyone kind of expects it. Now, it doesn’t have to be tons of video, you have a lot of good customer service, but they want to know you beforehand. Because if I have this known entity of someone, I know what they’re gonna look like and sound like and when I get a feel for them, I’m gonna spend $10,000 with them or someone I have no idea with, I have to get on a random zoom call with, we’re gonna choose.
Heather Pearce Campbell 34:15
Totally real and it is true the amount of information that you get, even from a very short video, like, you understand in a hurry somebody’s presence, kind of the feel of their personality, their voice and their intonation. Like there’s just stuff that you cannot get in any other way.
Ian Garlic 34:32
Nope, no. And we read faces, right? We read faces, and we read their body language and, you know, maybe you don’t like the person you like, well, if someone’s not gonna like this, and like, that’s probably a good thing. You turn people off as much as it turns them on.
Heather Pearce Campbell 34:44
Right? Me with my blue light glasses over here. I love that. I just gotta get the no glare version. So I want to totally be respectful of your time. I’ve just feel like there’s so many more questions I have right about how people can do this the right way. Hey, I want to ask you a question because you were on the Guts, Grit and Great Business® podcast. I want to hear what is just share one or two. I mean, we love stories of the gutsiest or grittiest thing you have done in your life.
Ian Garlic 35:15
Radius thing, man, I’ve done some great, like in business?
Heather Pearce Campbell 35:20
Anywhere. It could be personal. It could be business.
Ian Garlic 35:22
Oh, man, I’ve done some tough stuff.
Heather Pearce Campbell 35:26
Anything that comes to mind what comes to mind?
Ian Garlic 35:31
I mean, when I was in commercial real estate, I worked essentially for free for a year and bartender that night.
Heather Pearce Campbell 35:38
Working for free for a year doesn’t sound like a treat.
Ian Garlic 35:42
No commercial real estate in New York City. It’s as hard as it gets. And yeah, I, you know, would cold call people to try and get them to sell their buildings, and they have to, but that’s where I started using LinkedIn. And at night, I would I’d bartend and work full time. And it was tough because you ate and it’s expensive to live in New York.
Heather Pearce Campbell 36:04
So thank you for that bartending position. Right.
Ian Garlic 36:09
Yeah. I mean, I was lucky enough to get a you know, after it took me a while to get a good bartending job. But I worked at one of the top restaurants in the world. So that was cool. I got to meet a lot of famous people. Cool, fine. It was fun. It I mean, it’s tough. It’s just you know, being in businesses is tough. It’s a constant battle, you know, people suing you or threatening to sue you, or lawyers calling you at one o’clock in the morning telling you that they ruin your ruin their life.
Heather Pearce Campbell 36:38
Right, you’ve got all the lawyer stories, too, which is leads me into my next question. How did you get so much experience working with law firms and small law firms?
Ian Garlic 36:47
My first marketing consulting position was with Thomson Reuters fine law. So in New York City, so I started…
Heather Pearce Campbell 36:55
Oh so you working with for them, like working with their clients, right? Because they had a website building gig for a while.
Ian Garlic 37:03
Yeah, so I did that. And then worked with lawyers in New York City, which I’m sorry, as tough as it gets my first, I’m sorry. Second call I made guy. I went to the office, and the guy threatened to throw me out the window. And I’m like, well, you’re not gonna do that. I’m 6’6. And you’re like, 5’5? I’m like, okay. My first one was I went into Lower Manhattan, and which is like the financial district. And in New York, the number one type of case that lawyers want is construction accident cases, because there’s a law around it, so they instantly get like $500,000. And so everyone wants that. And I was like, time went to this guy. And I’m like, well, how do you get your cases? And he’s like, I make them happen.
Heather Pearce Campbell 37:56
Yeah, my whole my whole body is cringing. You know, the interesting thing is what got me into law, I was actually studying legal ethics. I took a business law class, and then at the same time, wrote a paper in my advanced writing class on legal ethics. And yeah, that is what led to me actually making them it’s awesome. But it’s, it’s so I’ve always had a really, really strong interest in ethics, especially in the overlap of like, the business law space. And so yeah, hearing that I’m like, Oh, my whole self cringes.
Ian Garlic 38:25
Oh, yeah. He was I mean, like, as Tony Soprano, looking, as you can imagine. And yeah, I mean, ethics. Yeah, I was thinking when I hear ethics, I’m like, I think Billy Madison, the ethics of business now. And if you love that movie, I love that movie.
Heather Pearce Campbell 38:43
I didn’t you know, I need to rewatch it. It’s been a few years since I’ve seen that because now you know, doing what I do. I see how unethical people are online when it comes, oh, my god, intellectual property of other businesses, right. All like, and I know how hard small businesses and entrepreneurs work to create what they have, like, that’s what irks me so badly. Right is like other people coming along and thinking they can just take it or rip it off or duplicate, you know, and so, yeah, I really, I joke, like, I keep thinking because I’m also an eternal optimist. Like one day, we’re gonna wake up and everybody on the internet is gonna have ethics. No, it’s not happening.
Ian Garlic 39:30
Ah, the worse. I mean, it’s just I can’t tell you how many marketing conferences I’ve been to. I’m like…
Heather Pearce Campbell 39:38
That you see the ripping off the copycatting.
Ian Garlic 39:41
They’re not afraid to lie about how much money you make or…
Heather Pearce Campbell 39:47
Right, all the scheme’s on the back end work.
Ian Garlic 39:50
Yeah. I mean, there’s a lot of people who are like, oh, yeah, I made $10 million last year in Click Funnels, and they failed to tell you that they spent $15 million in advertising,
Heather Pearce Campbell 39:59
Right? Are they gonna refund 5 million of it? Because they didn’t have purchasers that stick?
Ian Garlic 40:06
Yeah. Or do they just trick people? Yeah. All of that stuff. And it’s, you know, to me, it’s tough. And it’s hard because I see people with their business and also, they’re being told all these things that marketing can do. And I’m like, I can’t do all of that unless you do it the right way. And it takes a while. And yeah, people like to get a 10 to one return on investment. Like if you get a 10, one return on investment from anything all the time. Why are you telling people?
Heather Pearce Campbell 40:38
Bearing just over there doing it? No. So I ended up where I, you know, we’ll have to have a part to this conversation. I’m sure there’s way more to your story we need to hear about, I would love to know, where’s your favorite place to be online? Where do you like for people to come find you and connect with you?
Ian Garlic 40:59
Heather Pearce Campbell 41:01
You’ve heard it. We could have guessed that, right?
Ian Garlic 41:03
No, I mean, I’m on YouTube a lot. We have, you know, the video case story channel, I have my channel that I need to update. But also, I’m on LinkedIn, a decent amount and come say hi to me there.
Heather Pearce Campbell 41:13
Yeah, LinkedIn, I support LinkedIn.
Ian Garlic 41:15
Yeah. But if you do, make sure you mentioned Heather’s name in the podcast, because otherwise, I’m gonna assume that you are spamming me.
Heather Pearce Campbell 41:24
Also that’s happening now on LinkedIn, too, I guess.
Ian Garlic 41:28
Yeah. But I mean, those are like the main places. I’m an Instagram a little bit. I spend way too much time on social media. My wife’s on social media all the time. So you know, even though she’s on the couch next to me, that’s how I communicate with her.
Heather Pearce Campbell 41:39
Totally. Hey, babe. Yeah. That’s so funny. And you have a podcast. So let’s also have people hop over. Where can they find your podcast?
Ian Garlic 41:50
I have the Garlic Marketing Show. If you type in Garlic and Marketing, it’ll pop up on all the… it’s everywhere.
Heather Pearce Campbell 41:57
There’s like a scratch and sniff.
Ian Garlic 41:58
I know. I wish I’m trying to figure that one out.
Heather Pearce Campbell 42:02
I do love me some garlic.
Ian Garlic 42:05
Hopefully you do. The funny part. The funny part is people try and sell me garlic on LinkedIn all the time. Wholesale garlic. Oh, you’re kidding. Like real garlic, like real garlic. They’re like, suppliers. They’re like, do you want to reduce your garlic sauce? Because I guess that’s just the keyword.
Heather Pearce Campbell 42:25
I’m even laughing so hard. I can’t believe that’s a thing.
Ian Garlic 42:30
It’s hilarious. And it took me a while to realize it. Real quick before we go the other thing on LinkedIn that I realized, I get all these jobs, you know, these job listings? And it’s always for, like a host of a restaurant. And I’m like, is it because my restaurant background? And I realized, like maybe a month ago that was because I’m a host of a podcast and they assume host means restaurant hosts I’m getting like, I’m like, I’m not gonna go host it at Applebee’s.
Heather Pearce Campbell 42:59
Why am I being asked to host, that’s hilarious. I have not gotten any of those. Anyways, obviously my keywording is wrong. That’s really funny. Oh my gosh, so that I have like a whole new idea about how LinkedIn works. Well, that’s super fun. I really hope if you’re listening that you pop over, we’re going to share all of your links so you know your website, your social media, your YouTube, etc. Folks, you can find that on the show notes page which is legalwebsitewarrior.com/podcast go look for Ian Garlic’s episode. Ian, what final tip, you know, action step, whatever would you like to leave people with today?
Ian Garlic 43:43
Maybe dedicate 30 minutes a week to storytelling, email me at email@example.com. And tell me when you’re gonna do it. I want to see you do it. 30 minutes per week.
Heather Pearce Campbell 43:54
Per week. Sounds doable. I thought you were gonna say like, 30 minutes a day. 30 minutes a week sounds like okay, that’s something I can do.
Ian Garlic 44:02
You can do it. Collect the stories. Talk to one of your customers. Post the story if you do that, and a year from now, I guarantee you, your business will transform.
Heather Pearce Campbell 44:11
Love it. You heard it here, folks. I and I so appreciate you. I’m so glad that we finally had the chance to connect and I really will see you again soon.
Ian Garlic 44:19
Will see you soon.
Heather Pearce Campbell 44:20
GGGB Outro 44:23
Thank you for joining us today on the Guts, Grit and Great Business® podcast. We hope that we’ve added a little fuel to your tank, some coffee to your cup and pep in your step to keep you moving forward in your own great adventures. For key takeaways, links to any resources mentioned in today’s show and more, see the show notes which can be found at www.legalwebsitewarrior.com/podcast. Be sure to subscribe to the podcast and if you enjoyed today’s conversation, please give us some stars and a review on Apple podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcast so others will find us too. Keep up the great work you are doing in the world and we’ll see you next week.